Transcript of Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable: Jun 22, 2010
Topic: Open Forum
Thanks to Sheila for the photos. Join our VWER group at Flickr and add your own pictures!
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AJ Brooks: Hi everyone, and welcome to the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable meeting.
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Margaret
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: just back, btw....hello Dan, JC
AJ Brooks: Our meetings are made possible by the Office of Information Technology at Montclair State University. We meet here each week at 2:30pm SLT for an hour.
Csteph Submariner: Hi Zotarah
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Katie
AJ Brooks: Our meeting today is an OPEN FORUM. Hopefully you've brought some ideas, thoughts or questions.
Profdan Netizen: Hey, Iggy.
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi JimEd
AJ Brooks: For those sitting up in the amphitheater seating, please come down and join us around the roundtable. There is always an empty seat on the side closest to the ramp.
Katie Fenstalker waves at Zo
JeanClaude Vollmar: Hey Iggy, hey Zotarah
AJ Brooks: The Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable is a forum to educate and inform the community about issues that are important and relevant to education.
JimEd Monday: Hi ProfDan, Meredith
AJ Brooks: The views and opinions of any of our special guests or visitors do not necessarily represent those who volunteer or organize these meetings,
AJ Brooks: or of the College of Humanities and Social Sciences, Office of Information Technology , or Montclair State University.
Profdan Netizen: Greetings, JimEd.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: keep the love going, y'all :)
AJ Brooks: This is a public meeting, so we do keep and publish a transcript of what is said in local chat. For a copy of transcripts, please visit http://www.vwer.org
AJ Brooks: If you've not seen the transcripts, you should check them out - they are a great information asset.
AJ Brooks: The Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable meeting happens each week and we continue to develop a community of educators from around the world with a variety of thoughts, needs, and ideas.
Katie Fenstalker winks at Iggy.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Hi Piona...long time no see. Hi Lali and Ju
AJ Brooks: Please join the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable group here in SL. You can also find us on Facebook and Flickr by our full name and Twitter as VWER.
Lali Latte: Hi
JimEd Monday: Nice to see you here again Meredith :)
AJ Brooks: Finally, if you have Mystitool on, or other similar tool, please put it to sleep or detach it for now. :-) It tends to lag things.
Katie Fenstalker: hi1
AJ Brooks: Just one more reminder, we ask that everyone sitting in the theater seating join us around the roundtable. There is always an empty seat on side closest to the ramp.
Meredith Winslet: Hi JimEd
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Lali
AJ Brooks: As a hint, it is better to have "local chat" open for these meetings, it will help you follow along better.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia notes this will all be in our transcript :) Hi Meredith
Csteph Submariner sways from side to side and sings tunelessly "We are the world..."
JeanClaude Vollmar: it's so good to be here. Been having a hard time lately getting here. Now I realize how much I miss yous.
Lali Latte: Hi Zotarah
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Ju
AJ Brooks: Why don't we start off the way we always do, by introducing ourselves. No need to wait, go ahead and type into local chat now
AJ Brooks: Let us know who you are, what you do, and your educational affiliation.
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Pionia
AJ Brooks: My name is AJ Kelton and I am the Director, Emerging Instructional Technology for the College of Humanities and Social Sciences at Montclair State University in New Jersey
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: yep--this is a rock in a stormy sea
Ju Roussel: Hi Zotarah :)
Pionia Destiny: smiles
Margaret Michalski: Margaret Czart, Research Information Specialist from the University of Illinois at Chicago.
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Firery
Profdan Netizen: Dan Holt, Lansing Community College, Lansing, MI. I teach writing, both first year comp and creative writing.
Katie Fenstalker: Katie King from the University of Maryland, College Park -- Women's Studies.
Csteph Submariner: Hi Firery
Ignatius Onomatopoeia is Joe Essid, Faculty in Rhetoric & Communication studies at U Richmond, blogger, bald-headed freak, writer, part-time hillbilly
Firery Broome: Hello Zotarah
Lali Latte: Melinda Korzaan, Assistant Prof, Computer Information Systems. Middle Tennessee State University
AJ Brooks: Silhshoot, Firery, Graham, Pionia, Talus - please come on down and join us - you don't need to be active to sit at the table with us
JimEd Monday: Eli's Alt from Tulsa Community College
Meredith Winslet: History Teacher, CC and work in the library.
Delenn Daines: Judy Kelly, Biology, Henry Ford Community College, Dearborn, MI
Firery Broome: & Csteph as well : )
Zotarah Shepherd: I am a MA in Education (technology & psychology) student at Sonoma State University in northern California working on a curriculum project: Teaching and Learning Life Foundation Skills in Second Life.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Hi Fiery--thanks for that nice e-mail!
Pionia Destiny: I am an EFL professor.. researching how to use medieval sims to learn a new language
JeanClaude Vollmar: I'm Jeff Le Blanc in RL, JC here. I'm from the University of Northwestern Ohio and am the VP for IT there.
Ju Roussel: <-- phd student, Stockholm Univ.
Margaret Michalski: Hi Fiery
Firery Broome: you are welcome another on the way soon
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: woot!
Graham Mills: Peter Miller, University of Liverpool
AJ Brooks: anyone left to introduce?>
Firery Broome: Hi Margaret
Csteph Submariner: Chris Stephens - tinkerer and chief code monkey at CS dept in Oxford
AJ Brooks: going once
AJ Brooks: going twice
Katie Fenstalker: nice group.
Ahlan Oh: Alan Epstein, Watertown Public Schools, MA, USA
AJ Brooks: sold to the cardboard robot
Zotarah Shepherd: There is room for everyone at the table.
Margaret Michalski: lol
Zotarah Shepherd: hehe
AJ Brooks: well - whats on your mind today, who wants to get us started?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: meshes :)
AJ Brooks: lol
JimEd Monday: Iggy mentioned SL7B too
AJ Brooks: no wasting time, there, eh Iggy?
Margaret Michalski: well, I can say I am very glad we expanded our discussions beyond SL
AJ Brooks: ok - lest start with meshes
Katie Fenstalker: what are they?
AJ Brooks: Iggy - why don't you give us a primer
JimEd Monday: Hi Marc
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I got dope-slapped by content developers for suggesting that meshes might hamper edu builds
Zotarah Shepherd: I am a bit more relieved about the 30% LL layoffs.
Csteph Submariner: meshes ought to be a huge step forward, but I can't help wondering what the hidden gotchas are going to be
Katie Fenstalker is aware she is still SL centric and blushes.
Ju Roussel: Ignatius, how will they?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: A mesh is a type of 3D graphic far more realistic than our current prims w/ textures
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I'm not a techie
Profdan Netizen: My son, a graduate from the computer animation program at Ringling, was excited to hear about the imminent use of meshes.
Firery Broome: Photoshop can export the new 3D files!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: but the level of skill to develop them is beyond faculty like me
Katie Fenstalker: whre are they used usually?
Csteph Submariner: the software ain't cheap either
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Firery, that may help me. And Blender is free
Ahlan Oh: is this the same as a wireframe?
Ju Roussel: So basically will be able to import stuff from Google Sketchup and more advanced software?
Csteph Submariner: Maya is about $5 grand i think
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Ju--yes
AJ Brooks: thats awesome - sketchup is free
Firery Broome: Yes Blender is and lots of tuts. on the web for it
Firery Broome: and good books too
JeanClaude Vollmar: How are meshes different from sculpties?
Firery Broome: You can get an ed price for Maya
Katie Fenstalker nods and thanks JeanClaude
Ju Roussel: I can see everyone robbing the sketchup warehouse and importing those "borrowed" creations. (?)
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: don't know the learning curve or what it will do in terms of lag graphics reqs for SL
Profdan Netizen: YOu can import 3D creations from software outside of SL?
AJ Brooks: who else is using meshes - in VWS
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Already can, Dan
Csteph Submariner: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Frbz6tpLo0
Zotarah Shepherd: http://dusanwriter.com/index.php/2010/06/22/mesh-imports-in-second-life-imminent/
Firery Broome: Adobe has a link to some warehouses as well
Profdan Netizen: Iggy, from 3D programs like maya?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: our students made the House of Usher, in all its overprimmed and laggy glory, in Sketchup
Csteph Submariner: the vid is not an avatar but an animated mesh object
Ju Roussel: Yes, tomorrows metanomics (at 12.00) is supposedly dedicated to meshes.
Margaret Michalski: I heard of a Second Inventory software. I don't know if it has the capabilities
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: we'll have an SL that has the look of a well made video game, at least in areas with lots of new builds that use meshes
cyber Placebo: @Csteph how long does it take to create a 2mn vid like this
Zotarah Shepherd: Second Inventory is a bit pricy too.
Firery Broome: Sandcastle Studios are the guests should be good
AJ Brooks: so our poor tin cup edu builds will look like crap, is what you are saying
Csteph Submariner: SketchUp can export their collada format too I believe
Katie Fenstalker: @ Iggy -- you are paying for new level of realism with lag?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: expensive content could be imported from sites like this: http://www.turbosquid.com
Profdan Netizen: The other question that has come up is whether or not viewer 2.0 will be needed to see mesh stuff.
Zotarah Shepherd: Oh I hope not
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Katie--don't know. A few commenters at blogs think meshes will lessen lag
Perplexity Peccable: Thanks, AJ :)
Firery Broome: I think Turbosquid might be one of the links at Adobe
AJ Brooks: i think the old viewer will be going away sooner rather than later
Margaret Michalski: Hi Perplexity
Katie Fenstalker nods with interest at Iggy.
AJ Brooks: Hey lexi!
Perplexity Peccable: Hi, Kaite
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @AJ, then we'll all be naked if LL does not fix that bug
Perplexity Peccable: Katie
Perplexity Peccable: yep!
Profdan Netizen: Hi, Lexi.
Katie Fenstalker: Hi Lexi
AJ Brooks: grab seats, folks - the open one is closest to the ramp
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: and will get kicked out of SLB7
AJ Brooks: I'm not naked in SL2
Perplexity Peccable: Hi, Profdan :)
AJ Brooks: I've never been naked
JeanClaude Vollmar: Oh, oh. Gonna have to bite the bullet and download the new viewer then. *smiles* Have been dragging my feet on that one.
Meredith Winslet: it happens
AJ Brooks: I had to change back to male from female
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I'm keeping my hillbilly/hobo barrel around just in case
Perplexity Peccable: I am in SL@ - it often happens right after a TP
Perplexity Peccable: part of rezzing, I think
Katie Fenstalker is still feeling clunky in V2
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: LL will fix that bug, I'm sure
cyber Placebo: @ JC try kirsten (20)viewer
AJ Brooks: it does take a while to get used to
AJ Brooks: my big problem is finding things easily that I have no problem finding now
Delenn Daines wears lots of layers of clothing
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I wonder what will happen to 3rd party viewers not SL 2 compliant?
Profdan Netizen: Agreed, AJ, though I've been using it exclusively for the last couple months with no real problems.
Profdan Netizen: Actually, less crashing than with 1.23.
AJ Brooks: i'm switching back and forth
Ju Roussel: If they do no harm, they'll stay..
Margaret Michalski: Hippo stopped development I think
Csteph Submariner: Kirsten's viewer is v2 now
Margaret Michalski: Not sure what imprudence is doing
AJ Brooks: when I need to be sure I'll have no problem, like, now - I'm in the old viewer - otherwise, I try to default to the new one
Firery Broome: non compliant will not run
Csteph Submariner: but it's no better than the LL client
Zotarah Shepherd: V2 messed up V1 for me when I switched and it was hard to build with V2 so I really do not want to switch.
Csteph Submariner: to my mind
Firery Broome: just stop working
Talus Nemeth: many of the non SL2 viewers will have an extended lifespan in OpenSim venues.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Hippo was very good. What will OpenSim users use, then? Imprudence?
Perplexity Peccable: I found once I made the commitment to SL2 and quit switching back and forth, there were no further problems
Katie Fenstalker: lol
Perplexity Peccable: the trouble is when you switch back and forth
ffeldon Mint: I'm buying a new computer w Windows 7 64-bit. Any advice? Specifically regarding graphic cards?
Katie Fenstalker: I took your word for that Lexi -- me too.
Csteph Submariner: agreed Perplexity
Margaret Michalski: For now both but for how long I don't know
Marc Rexen: ATI works fine 5870
AJ Brooks: FFeldon - the graphic card recommendation are on the LL web site
Ju Roussel: Well, the viewer seems to be approaching the exit, too... The in-browser version is upon us!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: get as much RAM on board as you can
Perplexity Peccable: yes about RAM
ffeldon Mint: site doesn't have win 7 it's XP or Vista only
AJ Brooks: don't jump the gun on the death of the inworld viewer
Profdan Netizen: I really hope they don't dump the stand alone viewer for browser only.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Ju--that Web-based viewer is very exciting stuff
JeanClaude Vollmar: In browser will be fantastic to have!
Ju Roussel: AJ, I certainly hope so
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: for users like my students
Profdan Netizen: I hope we'll always have a choice.
Ju Roussel: I just can't imagine how the 2 would coexist.
Profdan Netizen: I agree, Iggy.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I'll want a builders version (if I ever learn meshes)
Perplexity Peccable: I want to learn mesh :)
Katie Fenstalker thinks a builders version has to be coming....
AJ Brooks: thats actually where this convo started, lexi
Zotarah Shepherd: With mesh out, I just hope my prim builds will not be obsolete.
AJ Brooks: lol
Ju Roussel: I think about Unity3D in-browser: requires high-end machines. I'm fond of my laptop, but Unity3D is a no go.
Csteph Submariner: I've been trying to get to grips with Maya, but it's a very deep program
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Perplexity, I am not whining but there's a cost/benefit for faculty here. I get little enough credit for using SL...why learn a new app when my review won't improve?
Perplexity Peccable: You mean SL2?
JeanClaude Vollmar: I've been goofing with sculpties, so meshes sounds interesting.
Katie Fenstalker nods at Iggy.
Perplexity Peccable: Personally, I found SL2 promotes student acceptance
Perplexity Peccable: which is the point after all
AJ Brooks nods at katie nodding at iggy
Katie Fenstalker: Still just trying to get people to try it.
AJ Brooks: the students who work for me LOVE SL2
Zotarah Shepherd: Just when you thought you knew SL well enough, something new comes out that you have to learn.
AJ Brooks: they refuse to use 1.23 anymore
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: This is a central problem of geting mainstream faculty on tenure-track or annual contracts into SL. We gotta make it as easy as possible. I can get as much credit for using a wiki or blogging with a class :)
Csteph Submariner nods at AJ nodding at katie nodding at iggy
Daring Melody: @Ju. Today's high end are run of the mill in a short time
Ignatius Onomatopoeia nods his bobble-head until it falls off and rolls across the floor.
Profdan Netizen: Agreed, Lexi, though I would think a browser based viewer would be even better for students, esp with the wide range of computers, and might make smart phones and tablets, like iPad, SL accessible.
Katie Fenstalker nods again at Iggy with a wink at AJ and Lexi.
Zotarah Shepherd: I want to focus on subject content here rather than learning new tech.
Ju Roussel: Daring, not if future is in the Cloud. I plan that my current machine will be the last powerful one.
Perplexity Peccable: Agreed, Profdan
Perplexity Peccable: tech keeps changing
Katie Fenstalker wants an SL ipad.
Perplexity Peccable: when you stop learning new tech, you have made yourself obsolete
AJ Brooks: Zotarah - being on the bleeding edge of things, you really can't get away with not focusing on tech - since it changes so frequently
Ignatius Onomatopoeia sings his old tune about "students want lightweight laptops and wireless...not gaming machines"
Csteph Submariner: good point Zo, all the eye candy in the world is not going to help a lack of basic content
cyber Placebo: @ AJ what do your students do with it
AJ Brooks: I WANT AN SL IPAD APP TOO!!!!!!!
Katie Fenstalker: lol
Csteph Submariner: I just want an iPad
Margaret Michalski: lol
Ju Roussel: Ignatius, it's truth.
Profdan Netizen: Agreed, Csteph.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia wants a Google tablet...don't tell Steve Jobs I'm a heretic.
AJ Brooks: cyber - you mean the students who work for me?
Zotarah Shepherd: I am ok with tech changing just not required. I don't want to have to redo what I have already built.
Margaret Michalski: I have an Opensim Ipad..made by me
JeanClaude Vollmar: Me three on the SL for iPad.
cyber Placebo: @ aj yes
Profdan Netizen: It's the first Apple product that Im' seriously consider buying.
Csteph Submariner: I have the iPad nano, otherwise called the iPhone
Ju Roussel ordered an ebook reader - thanks iPad for driving the prices down.
AJ Brooks: @cyber - they do their work. Building things, searching for stuff, etc....
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Margaret, what clients are 3RG users trying other than Hippo?
AJ Brooks: this is my team of students who work in SL
Perplexity Peccable: Zotarah, so building on what we've already learned rather than starting over
AJ Brooks: scaffolding
Daring Melody: @JU. Hmmm.Point taken
Katie Fenstalker: well it matters that people starting from scratch feel included in building too.....
Zotarah Shepherd: yes
Margaret Michalski: @ Iggy Imprudence has made 3rg their home but others use merekeet and a few other viewers. But Hippo and Imprudence are the most popular
Ju Roussel: Well meshes will be built outside
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Imprudence rocks...even if they removed features to avoid a LL law suit
Ju Roussel: Building in SL will remain a valuable (certifiable, even) skill
Csteph Submariner: I get the feeling that LL are heading towards separating content creation from the 'basic' client
Ju Roussel: Csteph, quite likely!
Katie Fenstalker: @Csteph -- I worry about taht.
AJ Brooks: csteph - explain
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Csteph, if the 8% edu figure is correct, and they need social users, it would make sense
Katie Fenstalker: the draw is that user generated content possibilities.
AJ Brooks: no create in the basic client?
Csteph Submariner: I don't mind as long as they still have some collaborative enviroment for builders
Perplexity Peccable: where does one find Impudence? that is new to me
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I'll get the URL for you
Perplexity Peccable: thx!
Zotarah Shepherd: I hope that building and content creation will not prohibit students from building in SL. They learn that way.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: http://imprudenceviewer.org/
Katie Fenstalker: I worry about professionalizing SL content.
Csteph Submariner: I would guess the proposed web client will have little in the way of building tolls
JimEd Monday: will building become more commercialized for some users then? - just buy things out of the box from businesses.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Katie, me too. Our DIY ethos here is so compelling.
AJ Brooks: so - if you want to create, use the app, if you want to just visit, use the wb
Margaret Michalski: Hi Olivia
Ju Roussel: LL are tired from the whining small scale content providers -- these changes will likely shift the economy toward "golden solution providers"
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Olivia
Profdan Netizen: Hi, Olivia.
Perplexity Peccable: Thanks, Iggy
Olivia Hotshot: Hey Everyone! happy Tuesday.
Katie Fenstalker: DIY is everything I think ....
AJ Brooks: OLIVIA!!!!!!!!
Csteph Submariner: I think engaging content will remain engaging content even after meshes come along
Olivia Hotshot: I snuck out of a meeting to be here.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: But the 2D Web went that direction. I had to get my own server to keep our U off my IP and wonky old projects designed before templates.
Olivia Hotshot: so far no one has missed me
AJ Brooks: we love you, olivia
Katie Fenstalker waves at Olivia -- the best!
Csteph Submariner: we absorbed sculpties ok
Olivia Hotshot: =)
Ignatius Onomatopoeia missed you!
Csteph Submariner: hi Olivia
JimEd Monday: welcome Olivia :)
JimEd Monday: Hi Sheila
Olivia Hotshot is blushing at the attention but loves it
AJ Brooks: Iggy - you're talking more and more like a techie (than a luddite)
Sheila Yoshikawa: hi, sorry i'm late
AJ Brooks: hey Sheila
JimEd Monday: Hi Sheila
Katie Fenstalker: hi
AJ Brooks: Hey - anyone planning on going to LL's B'day party?
Katie Fenstalker: ????
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @AJ--appropriate technology for luddites includes VWs...think of the carbon we are not spewing by meeting here
Olivia Hotshot: I am going. Will be a photo
Ju Roussel: it's a party every day ot?
Delenn Daines: let's all go after the meeting
Margaret Michalski: there is one?
Firery Broome: You bet for the B-day
Zotarah Shepherd: Oh I guess it is that time of year again huh?
Margaret Michalski: I got an anit LL t-shirt at helen keller day
Margaret Michalski: anti
Katie Fenstalker has a community Tea after this....
Firery Broome: #7 Margaret
Csteph Submariner: I'm up for a little after-school partying
Perplexity Peccable: that seemed strange
Profdan Netizen: I explored a bit in Blue Mars the other day. Although some nice shadowing, I didn't find the builds that much better than what we find here, so I don't think mesh will necessarily make current builds obsolete.
Perplexity Peccable: especially since LL helped support HKD
AJ Brooks: lol - I wasn't suggesting going - I'm not planning on it
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: It's a lag fest, however
Katie Fenstalker: Blue Mars has mesh already?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Katie, I think so
AJ Brooks: what other virtual worlds have meshes already
Profdan Netizen: They have pro builders using maya and such.
Perplexity Peccable: I wish Blue Mars worked on Macs
Firery Broome: It is a great way to see fantastic builds, lots of creativity there
Katie Fenstalker: mesh is associated with pros?
cyber Placebo: Blue Mars LM please :-)
Ju Roussel: ReactionGrid, via Jibe, I believe
Firery Broome: at the b-day
Csteph Submariner: I think most of the MMO game type VW use meshes
Olivia Hotshot: I agree @Perplexity
Zotarah Shepherd: I think students do better in SL when they socialize and go to events like RFL and the LL birthday
AJ Brooks: I agree Zotarah
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Let's hope that Linden Lab permits end users to continue developing; I'm not in Blue Mars b/c they heavily restrict UGC to professionals (and it's Windows only XD )
Katie Fenstalker agrees with Zo
Profdan Netizen: http://www.bluemarsonline.com/
Perplexity Peccable wonders if Blue Mars will work on my netbook, like SL does
Csteph Submariner: the file format LL are proposing to support is called COLLADA and is an industry standard
JeanClaude Vollmar: Any freebie software like Blender or Wings3D doing meshes?
AJ Brooks: the AH HA moment for my students was when we got off the MSU island and went to Info island for a tour by Lori Bell
Zotarah Shepherd: I have not been able to get into RG lately. I can't download the new viewer.
cyber Placebo: Acronyms...
Profdan Netizen: I seriously doubt it, Lexi!
Perplexity Peccable: AHA moment is a great way to put it, AJ
Csteph Submariner: @Lexi, Blue Mars barely runs on a Cray supercomputer cluster
Perplexity Peccable: :(
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Perplexity, NO way--you need a gamer PC to even try Blue Mars
Perplexity Peccable: well, glad SL runs on it!
AJ Brooks: thx lexi! :)
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Sorry for all the abbreviations
Csteph Submariner: np
AJ Brooks: luddite!
AJ Brooks: (iggy, not csteph)
Profdan Netizen: Not exactly, Iggy, just a pretty up to date graphics card--I got in with a 2008 laptop.
Katie Fenstalker wonders to what extent gamer sensibilities are driving realisms..?
Graham Mills: Um, isn't blue mars using otoy to stream?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia waves club and monkey wrench and yells "Hayduke lives!"
AJ Brooks: ROFl
AJ Brooks: Anyone going to SLCC (other than me and Olivia)
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Graham, they promise a Web based client too...and that would bring in Mac OS and Linux users
Profdan Netizen: video games is a larger industry than movies, so it has to be an influence.
Delenn Daines: I'm going to slcc too
Zotarah Shepherd: Too far for me AJ
Perplexity Peccable: what about EVE online?
Graham Mills: yes, and lower end hardware
Perplexity Peccable: I know Fleep is there
AJ Brooks: YAY - we should meet up Delenn
Csteph Submariner: I volunteered for the in-world build team, but I already had my trip to the US for this year :(
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Profdan, even video games are moving to a Web based model. What is that service that lets you run them on any platform?
Delenn Daines: definitely AJ!
Olivia Hotshot: how would one use Eve? I am interested in hearing that
Katie Fenstalker: Eve?
AJ Brooks: Oh - yes, I know Fleep - I meant from this group. I'm totally up for meeting folks in the actual worlds, its fun
Perplexity Peccable: I've seen her pics, but am not sure what she is doing
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Steam? Valve?
cyber Placebo: http://www.eveonline.com/races/
Profdan Netizen: That's right, Iggy, just checked that out with my son--Onlive or some such?
AJ Brooks: she is running the whole deal
Zotarah Shepherd: Eve?
Profdan Netizen: Where all rendering is done on the servers, not on the client.
Olivia Hotshot: Yes, Eve is a multiplayer game
Margaret Michalski: Hi Birdie
AJ Brooks: with a couple of other folks
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Mac users can play cool PC games now like Left for Dead
Csteph Submariner: Eve the space game?
Olivia Hotshot: yes CSteph
Perplexity Peccable: if you have enough RAM and space to run two OS
AJ Brooks: hey birdie
Katie Fenstalker is still playing Laura Croft....
Zotarah Shepherd: Hi Birdie!
Olivia Hotshot: Perplexity brought it up.
Profdan Netizen: http://www.onlive.com/
Birdie Newcomb: Hi
Katie Fenstalker: Hi
Olivia Hotshot: Hi Birdie.
Csteph Submariner: I played tha\t for a while,. Would be a ripe field for study by economists or sociologists
Olivia Hotshot: Or miners? =)
AJ Brooks: hey jared
Csteph Submariner: haha
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Perplexity, it would be even cooler to just run it w/o all that. The industry seems to recognize that the next gen of gamers are not geeks with high-end desktops
Csteph Submariner: I still see Omber asteroids in my dreams..
Olivia Hotshot: I can see WoW as a tool, but not sure about Eve
Perplexity Peccable: I was curious
Perplexity Peccable: I know TONS of folks teaching with WOW
Jarrad Voom: Hi AJ sorry I am late
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Olvia, Eve has a real economy, like SL
Perplexity Peccable: Maggie Marat for one major one
AJ Brooks: no worries, J - join us and enjoy
AJ Brooks: Maggie is awesome
Profdan Netizen: What types of classes in WoW, Lexi?
Olivia Hotshot: Yes, i understand that, just had not thought of eve as a teaching tool/
Perplexity Peccable: Maggie has a guild there just for teachers using WOW
Perplexity Peccable: there are gazillions of articles about it
Perplexity Peccable: easy to find with Google search
AJ Brooks: Cognitive Dissonance
Perplexity Peccable: lol
AJ Brooks: 27 on the sim for the record
Olivia Hotshot: i have an ethics issue with WoW in the classroom - but that is my gig.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: In fact, it would be a better place for economists to study virtual economies than WoW, from what I know if both worlds. But teaching in Eve might be tough. I don't think it has avatars. You build fleets and make money.
Katie Fenstalker: @Olivia -- how so?
Perplexity Peccable: maybe Fleep is just playing
Csteph Submariner: I always remember some lines from a report by some scientists who used WoW for a meeting when they reported that the meeting was without incident except for two people who drowned in lava and one who was eaten by a hyena
AJ Brooks: virtual economies, now you're like ted castranova
Olivia Hotshot: Well the premise is you kill things and steal their stuff.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Csteph ROFLMAO
Sheila Yoshikawa: lol
Olivia Hotshot: too funny
AJ Brooks: oh if that were only possible in the actual world
cyber Placebo: @ Olivia Please expand : i have an ethics issue with WoW in the classroom - but that is my gig.
Marc Rexen: :O
Profdan Netizen: Good point, Olivia.
Olivia Hotshot: [15:04] Olivia Hotshot: Well the premise is you kill things and steal their stuff.
Katie Fenstalker agrees with Olivia that that makes for a complex classroom....
Sheila Yoshikawa: whereas in the talk Maggie Marat gave on Saturday she was saying how in SL the people who were esteemed were the helpful ones
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Olivia, that's the history of the male-dominated civilization. Sad but true.
JimEd Monday: There was some chat on the SLED list about Inwordz - I'm not familiar with that one.
AJ Brooks: but you don't HAVE to do those things in WoW (says someone who has never played it)
Olivia Hotshot: Lots of great things there - but the killing bothers me
Perplexity Peccable: Bravo, Sheila :)
Perplexity Peccable: Glad you are here
JimEd Monday: anyone been there?
Marc Rexen: Inworldz is an SL clone on a shoestring.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Like OpenLife, I think
Margaret Michalski: I agree with olivia about the killing
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Margaret, how is 3RG working with the new OS currency?
AJ Brooks: not me - lets kill EVERYTHING!!!!!
Csteph Submariner: I joined SmallWorlds, but not impressed with it
AJ Brooks: (just kidding)
Olivia Hotshot: well you ARE from Jersey AJ.
Katie Fenstalker: lol
Zotarah Shepherd: My self-reward for finishing my thesis wil be to join WoW. : )
AJ Brooks: LOL
Olivia Hotshot: =)
JimEd Monday: lol
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @AJ--only if I can play in a Mad Max game or cap zombies. I get bored with the violent games.
AJ Brooks: exit 145 babe!
Olivia Hotshot: hahaha
Olivia Hotshot: i know that exit!
AJ Brooks: 15W on that other road
AJ Brooks: ROFL - I'm not surprised
Csteph Submariner: I played WoW for ages, but I gave up when I got to the end-game as it was just a massive time sink
Margaret Michalski: @ Iggy, I think they are working on it from what I know.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Csteph, I respect teachers trying to use WoW, but it's even less designed for something like this than SL was.
Olivia Hotshot: I am wondering how schools deal with the membership fees for WoW.
Csteph Submariner: interesting in that regard how it raises the value of 'time' over, necessarily, money
Zotarah Shepherd: I was a avid D&D player years ago and if I joined WoW I would probably not get anything else done.
Csteph Submariner: haha
AJ Brooks: thats why I don't play WoW
Zotarah Shepherd: hehe
AJ Brooks: I started playing D&D back in the late 70s
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: It would seem, Margaret, that developing a cross-worlds currency independent of the L Dollar will make a huge difference for OS worlds
Delenn Daines: my boys tell me I should be a shaman on WoW
Perplexity Peccable: I loved Rogue
Profdan Netizen: Yeah, I've heard WoW called virtual crack!
Perplexity Peccable: back in mainframe days
Ju Roussel: I'm interested to hear about WoW fees vs. education too, Olivia...
Csteph Submariner: rogue FTW!
Katie Fenstalker: how would a cross worlds currency work?
Olivia Hotshot: Anyone remember Diablo?
Perplexity Peccable: Rogue taught my daughter how to spell
Daring Melody: @Zotarah. I hear you. Stopped RPGing 24 yrs ago because of the same reasons
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Zo--nice thing about face-to-face RPGs. You can have a nerd-night as I do, and still have a life.
Margaret Michalski: oh yes, I just have been out of that loop. Busy developing a 3rg University
Perplexity Peccable: "Help, Mommy! A C is trying to get me!"
Csteph Submariner: haha
Zotarah Shepherd nods to Daring.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I dislike MMORPGs because you can't just play once per week with your guild. They want you there.
Ahlan Oh: it's like political work
Perplexity Peccable: Iggy, they can be very instructive, but also very stressful
Csteph Submariner: yer, they don't favour the casual player mostly
Ignatius Onomatopoeia still games one night a week
Zotarah Shepherd: I used to play 2 or 3 times a week with my friends for hours.
Margaret Michalski: @ Iggy 3rg non-techies are concentrating on the use of OpenSim for education. Techies worry about the rest
AJ Brooks: REALLY @Iggy
Katie Fenstalker wants to be casual in gaming.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: we are all so old that we have to stop by 10:30 :)
AJ Brooks: ROFLMAO!!!!!!
Perplexity Peccable: lol :)
Csteph Submariner: I've played lots of different MMO, but none to the highest levels
Profdan Netizen: lol
Delenn Daines has a gaming laptop but uses it for sl
Meredith Winslet: definitely lol
Zotarah Shepherd: I am too obsessive to play casually. hehe
Perplexity Peccable smiles at Delenn
Olivia Hotshot: I used to play WoW for hours too - and then i lost the reason why i wanted to
Katie Fenstalker: what counts as a gaming laptop?
AJ Brooks: if you like to play, I'm not so sure there is any such thing as casual
Perplexity Peccable: Sorry, Olivia :(
Csteph Submariner: we so need a VWER WoW guild...
Profdan Netizen: I want to get a gaming computer, just so I can use Ultra settings in SL.
AJ Brooks: i use them when I take pictures
Olivia Hotshot: Thanks Perplexity! =) I am in a recovery program.
Olivia Hotshot: hehe
Marc Rexen: i7 quad core, 5870 video Asus makes one for $1,500.
AJ Brooks: how many peopel here have been into WoW - say YES
Csteph Submariner: yes
Marc Rexen: yes\
Perplexity Peccable: Yowsa, Marc - sounds powerful
Profdan Netizen: n
Katie Fenstalker: n
Olivia Hotshot: yes
Meredith Winslet: n
Perplexity Peccable: n
Graham Mills: n
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: yeah, I'd like that sort of machine for my monthly road trip in SL--or to race other SLers
Delenn Daines: When you go to the manufacturers website, there is a separate category for gaming laptops
Sheila Yoshikawa: n
JimEd Monday: n
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: n
Lali Latte: n
Silhshoot Seelowe: have only viewed it over a students shoulder ã‹¡
Jarrad Voom: yes
Pionia Destiny: no
Birdie Newcomb: n
Margaret Michalski: no
JeanClaude Vollmar: I'm afraid to start WoW. I know I'd be hooked for sure.
Zotarah Shepherd: n
Profdan Netizen: Used to explore the Myst online MMO, URU.
Olivia Hotshot: [waves south to Shil]
Perplexity Peccable agrees with JeanClaude
Csteph Submariner: anyone remember Ultima Online? around '95 '96
Birdie Newcomb: I was looking at the ones for Mac - lame
Perplexity Peccable: Birdie, what on Mac?
Silhshoot Seelowe whispers: Hi Olivia
Olivia Hotshot: =)
Katie Fenstalker: @Birdie -- gaming laptop Mac version?
Birdie Newcomb: mmorpgs
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: last game on a computer played: Great War at Sea..WW II single player. I just don't dig online games for some reason.
Olivia Hotshot: Does anyone think there are any Facebook Game apps worthy of inclusion in education?
Profdan Netizen: Just played Zelda on Wii--last time I had played was 2006!
Zotarah Shepherd: I bought my PC Vista because it was for gaming which runs SL better, after 2 years it is old.
Csteph Submariner: I try to avoid FB games
Margaret Michalski: good question Olivia...don't really know
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: could be a great place for useful games--Facebook. No barrier for students
JeanClaude Vollmar: @Olivia, Farmville! LOL There's got to be and educational aspect of that.
Katie Fenstalker plays Lexulous and Happy Aquarium -- sees no ed uses....
Olivia Hotshot: Csteph, me too, but i am wondering if there is something out there worth looking at
Perplexity Peccable: I know lots of gaming faculty build FB games for education - outreach / healthcare / behavior mod, etc
Zotarah Shepherd: Maybe different games work for different subjects/teaching styles.
Profdan Netizen: Though, creepy treehouse begins to raise it's head with requiring FB.
Olivia Hotshot: JeanClaude - i am laughing now.
Ju Roussel: FB - as in FaceBook - games?!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I wish something like the old Geopoliticks game would emerge there. Combined economics, diplomacy, spycraft. It would be great in certain courses. It ran on old pre-Internet bulletin board systems.
Katie Fenstalker: requiring FB? how's that Profdan?
Olivia Hotshot: Iggy is right though - low barrier if any
Margaret Michalski: @ perplexity, thanks I will need to check those out
Jarrad Voom: I'm with Iggie
Csteph Submariner: i think it's worth looking at how the current crop of 'youth' experience the virtual world
Zotarah Shepherd: I think virtual worlds work better since you can take more constructive approach.
Sheila Yoshikawa: Don't know if this is relevant - but at a talk I was at on Monday, a speaker (head of elearning at Bath uni) was saying how in a survey only % of students said they would be willing to 17% said they were likely to use their own money to access learning stuff on their mobile phones, this is vaguely tying up with something said ages ago (I think - I feel ok getting them to sign up to SL cos it is free, is it acceptable to require them to sub to some game that does require money to play?
Perplexity Peccable: Oui, Ju, c'est vrai
Ju Roussel: 'creepy treehouse' - the phrase of the day :)
Csteph Submariner: and I think it's more likely something like Habbo or |Gaia than games/3D
Olivia Hotshot: games that are browser based and cost zero interest me.
Sheila Yoshikawa: that should have been "only 17%"
Olivia Hotshot: Ju, i thought the word of the day was Back Channel. (wait that is 2 words)
Profdan Netizen: Link for creepy treehouse: http://flexknowlogy.learningfield.org/2008/04/09/defining-creepy-tree-house/
Perplexity Peccable: Thanks Profdan!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Sheila, I read that for US students born since 1982, there's two things they want things to be online: free and "not suck."
JimEd Monday: playing devil's advocate here: http://www.cracked.com/article_18461_5-creepy-ways-video-games-are-trying-to-get-you-addicted_p1.html ( Email5 Creepy Ways Video Games Are Trying to Get You Addicted)
Sheila Yoshikawa: I had a debate with someone about whether it was fair to apply creepy treehouse just to online environments
Csteph Submariner: I know this is not MMO, but I love little 'games' like this
Csteph Submariner: http://www.funny-games.biz/reaction-effect.html
AJ Brooks: wow - I go away to answer the phone and this conversation is all over the map now - LOL
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: but I bet they'd way a little for convenience (on smart phones, for instance)
Zotarah Shepherd: If students cannot create in a program then I have little interest in it for teaching.
Ju Roussel: So, since I'm outside of US... Is use/design on base of (insert game name) part of curriculum in instructional design programs? Who are the people who create FB-based game for a university instructor?
Sheila Yoshikawa: we create creepy treehouses in physical universities, lure the students into coffee shops and comfy chairs etc
(Short Editorial: Iggy missed this comment...darn. The coffee shop on my campus is very popular with students. They feel that they own it, and faculty are on their territory when there, but we all use it for meetings. So I guess it depends on the design and sense of ownership)
Perplexity Peccable: a friend at work was teasing me and said dataviz is my "porn" - made us both laugh
Katie Fenstalker likes iPhone koi pond....
Katie Fenstalker agrees with Lexi....
Katie Fenstalker: data sound now too!
Sheila Yoshikawa: I was sort of joking there but i get cross when it is implied online automatically includes a creep factor
Katie Fenstalker agrees with Sheila
Perplexity Peccable: Well, Sheila, doesn't offline automatically include a creep factor?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I fell into the Uncanny Valley when I looked at those gaming avatars at Turbosquid
Perplexity Peccable: think of the Catholic Church
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: creeped me out big time
Katie Fenstalker: @Lexi LOL
Profdan Netizen: I agree as well--but I have a problem with requiring students to use a social network like FB, and requiring them to "friend" me.
Ju Roussel: What about the Catholic Church?
Perplexity Peccable: there are creeps everywhere, online is no exception
AJ Brooks: FOLKS - BEFORE WE ALL START TO SPLIT UP - JUST WANTED TO TELL YOU THE TOPIC FOR NEXT WEEKS MEETING "Does SL enhance the learning experience?"
Katie Fenstalker: I agree with you Profdan.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia sits on his lapsed Catholic hands and will only tell stories offline :)
Perplexity Peccable: Right, Profdan - that is not ok
JeanClaude Vollmar: I agree Lexi
Pionia Destiny: great topic...
AJ Brooks: I hope folsk will bring examples, from both yes and no perspective
Katie Fenstalker: Afterall their FB shouldn't be colonized by academic capitalism....
Margaret Michalski: @ profdan yeah, as a doctoral student they made me join or else. Some sort of monitoring system but I don't have anything to hide
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Katie, only other forms of capitalism?
Katie Fenstalker: some are better than others.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: agreed
Pionia Destiny: I ask my students to join Fb..
JeanClaude Vollmar: Besides, everyone's a stranger online most times. Didn't mommy say don't talk to strangers? If so, none of us would be here if we took her advices.
Birdie Newcomb: I had a waking vision of what the Linden plan for SL on a browser might look like: floating bubbles of people who don't yet have an avatar -- they can look and move but not build or talk. Creepy.
Pionia Destiny: I found that it's a great way to keep in touch... but they join only if they want to
Katie Fenstalker: If you could have multiple FB it would okay to require,
JeanClaude Vollmar: I've only met a few of you in RL.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Birdie, that is Giulio's vision--the guy who posts to SLED
Sheila Yoshikawa: re: next week, surely it will be a short meeting, we just say "yes" and go home lol
Zotarah Shepherd: hehe
Margaret Michalski: @ pionia if a teacher asks it is different. But if the department wants it then...total different story
Csteph Submariner: haha
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: he claims his business clients just walk away at the thought of an avatar, but they want bubbles
Katie Fenstalker: but once they are on it for school that makes for not using it as well for other things.
Zotarah Shepherd: Open ended questions work better.
Sheila Yoshikawa: @birdie agree that IS a creepy treehouse
Perplexity Peccable: Teachergirl Razor does a great thing
Perplexity Peccable: offers offline equivalents for SL instruction
Perplexity Peccable: but makes the SL part slightly easier ;)
Pionia Destiny: I see your point..
AJ Brooks: That was the most voted for topic suggestion. I didn't phrase it. :-)
Katie Fenstalker: likes TG way of doing it....
Profdan Netizen: That's intriguing, Lexi.
Perplexity Peccable: she gest a lot of student choosing teh SL portion
AJ Brooks: jsut a reminder folks - also - you can add topic ideas or vote for the ones that are already there
Perplexity Peccable: but no one is forced
Katie Fenstalker: Teacher Girl is tremendously creative.
AJ Brooks: margaret, do you have the URL handy for that?
Zotarah Shepherd: Maybe add. If so how?
AJ Brooks: I think this is it http://goo.gl/mod/FLSv
Margaret Michalski: give me a minute and I will get it up
AJ Brooks: no - thats not is, sorry folks - thanks Margaret 0- We'll wait for yours
Zotarah Shepherd: An aside. Are any of you in doctoral programs using SL?
Katie Fenstalker: n but wish I was
AJ Brooks: I will be studying VWs as part of my doctoral program
AJ Brooks: my focus is on social applications, including VWs
Perplexity Peccable: Teachergirl has several grad students working on dissertations based in SL
Zotarah Shepherd: I am looking for a PhD in education program where I can continue my research.
Margaret Michalski: Suggest and Vote for Future Meetings
1)For the VWER Reading Meetings, visit http://bit.ly/a1IRau
2)Have an idea for a meeting topic or theme?
Visit http://bit.ly/dkDynw and add yours, or vote what is currently there
3)Know someone who you think would make an excellent special guest to be interviewed? Click here: http://bit.ly/bHVzZk
Csteph Submariner: not yet Zo, but heading that way in the next year or so
Margaret Michalski: here are all
Margaret Michalski: lol
AJ Brooks: Thanks Margaret
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: thanks Margaret! I'll move those links to the top of the transcript
AJ Brooks: please go and vote - vote early, vote often
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: it am the hillbilly way :)
JimEd Monday: my advisor shot down SL as a topic
Zotarah Shepherd: I have a Education Thesis Collective meeting on Saturday at 5:30pm slt. All are welcome.
Zotarah Shepherd: Ok Csteph.
Profdan Netizen: Slurl,Zo?
Csteph Submariner: argh, kinda late for the UK otherwise I'd love to
Csteph Submariner: I may anyway
AJ Brooks: what is an Education Thesis Collective meeting?
Sheila Yoshikawa: who needs sleep, eh?
Csteph Submariner: hahaha
Csteph Submariner: sleep is for wimps
Margaret Michalski: needs more hours in a day
Zotarah Shepherd: A group for people working on thesis projects or research in education in SL. We have some PhD students there too.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Csteph--say THAT in 20 years, sonny
JeanClaude Vollmar agrees with Margaret
AJ Brooks nods "thanks Z"
Csteph Submariner: haha, in 20 years I'll be retired for 5 years
Csteph Submariner: so it won't matter :)
AJ Brooks: FOLKS - BEFORE WE ALL START TO SPLIT UP - JUST WANTED TO TELL YOU THE TOPIC FOR NEXT WEEKS MEETING "Does SL enhance the learning experience?" I hope folsk will bring examples, from both yes and no perspective
AJ Brooks: if you didn't get it before :-)
AJ Brooks: it was very chatty at that point - may have scrolled by
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: good topic AJ, though I enjoy the Chao...I mean open forums :)
Margaret Michalski: does it have to be personal experiences?
AJ Brooks: thanks everyone for another GREAT roundtable
Margaret Michalski: or articles etc
Zotarah Shepherd: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Ralanora/130/126/22
Perplexity Peccable: lol, Iggy :)
AJ Brooks: anything, i guess, Margaret - is fine
Katie Fenstalker: thanks to all as usual.
Lali Latte: thank you
AJ Brooks: we'll do more open forums, I think
Sheila Yoshikawa: thanks
Perplexity Peccable wishes she could come more often
Margaret Michalski: ok
AJ Brooks: I like them too
Meredith Winslet: Yes -- it's intriguing
Marc Rexen: Thank you AJ.
Delenn Daines: g'night all!
Margaret Michalski: it is time already
AJ Brooks: Lexi - great to see you as always
Csteph Submariner: just wanted to share this pic from a nascent attempt at using VW fir teaching..
Csteph Submariner: http://users.ox.ac.uk/~csteph/tempest/
Profdan Netizen: Excellent discussion, thanks, AJ.
Margaret Michalski: geeze that flew by
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: see ya'll at the birthday bash soon
Margaret Michalski: thanks AJ
JimEd Monday: thanks AJ - fun as always
Zotarah Shepherd: This hour sure flew by
AJ Brooks: thanks everyone - have fun!
Csteph Submariner: nite nite all
AJ Brooks: see you next week
Zotarah Shepherd: Thanks AJ
Margaret Michalski: nite all
Sheila Yoshikawa: bye
Zotarah Shepherd: Bye
Daring Melody: By all
JeanClaude Vollmar: Bye everyone. Good to see you.
Pionia Destiny: Thanks.... I hope I can join you next meeting... safe paths... everyone..
AJ Brooks: later JC
Csteph Submariner: so, who was for crashing SL7B?
Perplexity Peccable: ciao!
Zotarah Shepherd: Where is it?
Csteph Submariner: no idea
Perplexity Peccable: lol
Csteph Submariner: I was hoping someone else knew :
AJ Brooks: guess they didn't do such a good job of getting the word out
Csteph Submariner: lol
AJ Brooks: if SL were a dog, it would be 49 now
Zotarah Shepherd: Wow there are lots of sims
Csteph Submariner: plus ça change..
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: hey, that's my age :)
AJ Brooks: but SL will be 6 years older than you next year, if it makes it
Csteph Submariner: aha, you only have 2 years on me
Margaret Michalski: you guys are too funny
Csteph Submariner: actually one
AJ Brooks: me too -
Csteph Submariner: now I count..
Margaret Michalski: missed you the passed few weeks
AJ Brooks: when do you leave for Poland?
Zotarah Shepherd: Something going on at SL7B Rare and Supernatural
Margaret Michalski: July 22nd-Aug 11th
Silhshoot Seelowe: bye folks, thanks for letting me sit in.
Margaret Michalski: so still around
AJ Brooks: come back anytime silhshoot