Transcript of Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable: April 27, 2010
Topic: Digital and Multimedia Literacy
Thanks to Lolly for the photos. Join our VWER group at Flickr and add your own pictures!
Links of Interest:
Olivia Hotshot: Hi everyone, and welcome to our weekly Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable meeting.
Olivia Hotshot: If you are sitting in the amphitheater seats, we ask you to come down and join us around the roundtable. There is always an empty seat closest to the ramp.
Kali Pizzaro: 21 for the transcript
Olivia Hotshot: Our meetings are made possible by the Office of Information Technology at Montclair State University. We meet here each week at 230 pm SLT for an hour.
Olivia Hotshot: The Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable is a forum to educate and inform the community about issues that are important and relevant to education.
Olivia Hotshot: Today's meeting will be in TEXT CHAT only.
Olivia Hotshot: The views and opinions of any of our special guests or visitors do not necessarily represent those who volunteer or organize these meetings, or of the College of Humanities and Social Sciences, Office of Information Technology , or Montclair State University
Olivia Hotshot: This is a public meeting, so we do keep a transcript of what is said in local chat. For a copy of transcripts, please visit http//www.vwer.org
Olivia Hotshot: Some of our transcripts are now available transcribed into a sound file. You can find them in iTunes Podcasts by searching for VWER.
Olivia Hotshot: The Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable meeting happens each week and we are looking to develop a community of educators from around the world with a variety of thoughts, needs, and ideas.
Olivia Hotshot: Please join the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable group here in SL. You can also find us on Facebook, LinkedIn, Flicker, and KoinUp, as well as on Twitter as VWER.
Olivia Hotshot: Finally, if you have Mystitool on, or other similar tool, please put it to sleep or detach it for now. -) It tends to lag things.
Olivia Hotshot: I'm Olivia, the jill of all trades for this group, and I'm hosting today for AJ Brooks. If you've not seen the transcripts I run, you should check them out - they are a great information asset.
Olivia Hotshot: (Iggy runs - sorry)
Olivia Hotshot: Why don't we get started they way we usually do, by introducing ourselves. No need to wait, go ahead and type who you are, where you are, and your ties to education into local chat.
Olivia Hotshot: I am Ann Steckel, an educational technology consultant and educator from California State University, Chico.
Grinn Pidgeon: Dr. Barbara Pittman, Cuyahoga Community College, Cleveland, Ohio. Faculty Development/Instructional technology/English teacher
Ignatius Onomatopoeia runs only from trouble :)
Profdan Netizen: I'm Dan Holt, professor at Lansing Community College, Lansing, MI.
Birdie Newcomb: Birdie Newcomb, entrepreneur
Bungy Bingyi: David Smith, Director of Technology, Oakland School for the Arts
Teri Boxen: Teri Lind, Nurse educator California STate University, East Bay
Ilene Pratt: Ilene Frank in RL - librarian teaching online courses for University of Maryland University College
Kathryn Pleides: Kathryn Frech, hs librarian and tech person
Firery Broome: University of Delaware
Margaret Michalski: Margaret Czart, Research Information Specialist , University of Illinois at Chicago
Ignatius Onomatopoeia is Joe Essid, Dept. of Rhetoric and Communication Studies. I'm the University of Richmond's Writing Center and Writing Across the Curriculum Director. I've taught four courses with SL. I'm part of a design team building an immersive simulation of Poe's House of Usher. This simulation debuted in the 2009-2010 academic year.
Ruby Lysette: Jenny Saxton, Librarian, Miami Dade College. SL Newbie
Callista Silvansky: Kimmy Hescock, visual information designer, Oregon State University
Maximum Goldshark: Jim Aird, credential candidate, CSU, Chico.
Arika Baroque: Marcie Sonneborn, Syracuse University, Entrepreneurship (Adjunct)
Trudy Takacs: Trudy Takacs, i-Learning Workshops and Coordinator, CT-NY Talent for Growth
Kali Pizzaro: Evelyn McElhhinney Lecturer Rn Glasgow Caledonian University
Olivia Hotshot: Anyone else?
LoCE99Ch8 Morpork: Rosanna Brown, Lassen Community College Library, Susanville (northeastern), California, rbrown@lassencollege.edu, @RbrownLassen. In world, call me Lo.
Hypatia Pickens: Hypatia Pickens from the University of Rochester... who just got here.
CindyBolerosAlt Sorbet: SL Solution Provider, Video Webcast Director, VW Educator at Las Positas College, Owner/Developer Aero Pines Park, First Responder and Hazardous Occupations Training SImulators
Soleil Lemondrop: Janet Salmons- Capella University-- just created a Leadership Learning Commons and designed a new MS Leadership course
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: good crowd today--lots of content creators!
Olivia Hotshot: Hello and welcome to you all. So lets get started. Today's conversation is about multimedia literacy. Some believe that this is a true literacy, others don't so lets start by forming a working definition of multimedia literacy or visual literacy at least
CindyBolerosAlt Sorbet: I heard cursive is going to the wayside
Olivia Hotshot: So just post into chat and i will attempt to pack it all up at the end.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: My own curiosity began when a collegue in English yelled at me "there IS NO visual literacy!"
Olivia Hotshot: what is multimedia literacy?
martinecourantrife Snowpaw: hi dan
martinecourantrife Snowpaw: ok thats fine
martinecourantrife Snowpaw: when is the one for next week?
Hypatia Pickens: I'm only beginning to understand it... a little.
Trudy Takacs: hmm the ability to distinguish meaning/content from a variety of communications via media
Grinn Pidgeon: Ability to find and evaluate digital media--create digital media
?
Trudy Takacs: my guess
Birdie Newcomb: right-brain activity
CindyBolerosAlt Sorbet: To be multimedia literate, I would have to be able to learn applications easy and fast to keep up
Olivia Hotshot: From what i can gather it started int he 1960's and was defined as a means of obtaining knowledge from visual sources.
Trudy Takacs: oh I think of the user not the designer for the literacy
Grinn Pidgeon: use a variety of media to compose an argument
Hypatia Pickens: We have CD-ROMs at my library for the study of medieval manuscripts. We have the Blake Archives which examine William Blake's illustrations
Margaret Michalski: for me it is being able to learn using movies, audio and virtual environments
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I've started using the term "analysis" instead of literacy, as in this assignment about Ansel Adams: http://iggyssyllabus.pbworks.com/Visual%C2%A0Analysis%3A-Ansel%C2%A0Adams
Jerod Bagley: Is multimedia literacy the same as fluency in the use of multimedia or something different?
Kali Pizzaro: cognitive and sociocultural understanding of information in a number of different media
Maximum Goldshark: If you can use technology for creating and editing documents, images, sound and video files and are capable on the hardware pieces..
Hypatia Pickens: I also teach film... so I'm familiar with that form of visual literacy.
Soleil Lemondrop: visual literacy is not new: one definition "the ability to decode and interpret (make meaning from) visual messages and also to be able to encode and compose meaningful visual communications (Debes, 1968).
Trudy Takacs: or is it being able to have literacy via you tube, websites, etc.
Olivia Hotshot: Jerod, we're hammering it our now
Birdie Newcomb: Yes, literacy means letters
Hypatia Pickens: agreed, Maximum
Kathryn Pleides: not use, understanding, interpretation, analysis
Trudy Takacs: yes, decode and interpret properly
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Birdie...that's what upset my colleague..literacy means textual.
Kali Pizzaro: yes Kathyrn
Ilene Pratt: Is analysis of Ansel Adams something different from doing art history?
Hypatia Pickens: Oh dear!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Ilene...very different
Kali Pizzaro: beyond being able to read written text
Olivia Hotshot: i agree very different
Grinn Pidgeon: understanding visual rhetoric--the rhetoric of images, etc.
Ilene Pratt: so that's got to be in the definition - What makes it different?
Kali Pizzaro: but what is multimedia
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: it means looking at the photograph in a certain way one might not in an Art History class...but in a way one might as a photographer or designer
Hypatia Pickens: I have a friend who is an optics physicist who examines the brush strokes of painters.... not interested in the aesthetics of the piece.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: SL has great potential in this regard
Hypatia Pickens: So I say that there can be a difference in this regard... is it a humanities or a scientific approach?
Trudy Takacs: well, Internet literacy takes new meaning these days
Trudy Takacs: with the multimedia being use
Olivia Hotshot: so are we all clear on this? this is a literacy separate from the written word?
Trudy Takacs: used
Trudy Takacs: oh definitely
Kali Pizzaro: yes
Hypatia Pickens: Inclusive of the written word, thogh
Maximum Goldshark: yes
Profdan Netizen: Well, it includes written word, doesn't it, Olivia?
Trudy Takacs: yes
Hypatia Pickens: Agreed Prodan...
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: yes--agreed. Though I prefer "analysis" nowadays to avoid conflict on campus.
Olivia Hotshot: it does, but the meaning or knowledge is gained from the visual aspect
Hypatia Pickens: Isn't the study of literature analysis Iggy?
Hypatia Pickens: I don't understand the distinction.
Olivia Hotshot: in reading about this the word technacy is being used in place of literacy
Trudy Takacs: @Hypatia, I'm thinking in terms of students
Trudy Takacs: and consumers
Hypatia Pickens: Analysis versus what?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Hypatia..yes, though Hermeneutics is the hip term these days
Trudy Takacs: less about the 'study'
Hypatia Pickens: ha!
Trudy Takacs: I'm thinking in terms of what can people decipher for meaning
Trudy Takacs: in this world of multiple medias
Hypatia Pickens: so..... analysis versus interpretation? (hermeneutics)
Olivia Hotshot: OK, now that we hashed it about let me toss out a definition:
Olivia Hotshot: --Multimedia literacy is a new aspect of literacy that is being recognized as technology expands the way people communicate. The concept of Literacy emerged as a measure of the ability to read and write. In modern context, the word means reading and writing at a level adequate for written communication. A more fundamental meaning is now needed to cope with the numerous media in use, perhaps meaning a level that enables one to successfully function at certain levels of a society.
Soleil Lemondrop: i agree Olivia-- but in some cases-- we are using visuals instead of words to ain understanding across language differences
Jerod Bagley: But Iggy, analysis indicates that it is only the receiving end rather than two way communication using multimedia. Is that what you really mean?
Olivia Hotshot: good point @Soleil
Soleil Lemondrop: for example the circle with slash we no means "no" whether we understand the words on a sign etc
Olivia Hotshot: good example.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia likes Olivia's definition...b/c virtual worlds can be seen as a form of 3D "writing." Vie, who was here last week, has said as much
Hypatia Pickens: Semiotics has been around for a while.
Birdie Newcomb: Literacy enables us to communicate, even with the dead.
Jerod Bagley: whoa
Birdie Newcomb: It's a shorthand
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Jerod--good point. I was thinking that my writers would conduct analysis of what others had done. Two-way was not needed for their projects in SL.
Hypatia Pickens: the study of multimedia literacy may be a perfect use of semiotics... but this has been a topic of popular culture for a long time.
Birdie Newcomb: Well, the dead communicate to us
Olivia Hotshot: Birdie, how do you mean with the dead?
Hypatia Pickens: Those artists no longer able to explain their work?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia picks up Shakespeare's "Anthony & Cleopatra"
Birdie Newcomb: Literacy is a mediator between people,
Birdie Newcomb: you can stuff it in a book
Birdie Newcomb: or a library
Kathryn Pleides picks up a volume of Frost's poems
Olivia Hotshot: ahh good point
Birdie Newcomb: Other media can do the same, but not with the precision
Hypatia Pickens picks up a Superman graphics novel
Kathryn Pleides: Though I would say the dead communicate with us, not the other way round.
Olivia Hotshot: now that we sort of have an idea of what we are talking about let me pose a question to the group: --How can a virtual world teach students to better derive knowledge from non-print forms of communication?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia grins at Hypatia
Birdie Newcomb: exactly
Birdie Newcomb: From a thousand years ago
Kali Pizzaro: by engaging all of their senses
Kathryn Pleides sniffs the air
Hypatia Pickens: well, on SL... only two senses.
Hypatia Pickens: hahahah Kath
Kali Pizzaro: well scratch and sniff is coming in viewer 2.0.2
Ilene Pratt: Another sense - what's that word for "sense of space"?
Hypatia Pickens: We may be able to walk around the virtual Beowulf manuscript
Olivia Hotshot: omg
Hypatia Pickens: laughs at Kali
Kali Pizzaro: hehe
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: in my classes, I teach the rule of thirds and the CARP/CRAP/PARC principles from graphic design. Sometimes I add film-studies basics. Then the writers employ them in SL.
Birdie Newcomb: kinesthesia
Kathryn Pleides: Hy - now that is something incredible
Kali Pizzaro: now i am joking before someone posts that to their blog
Hypatia Pickens: It would still be virtual.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: CARP: Color, Alignment, Repetition, Proximity
Hypatia Pickens: One or three steps away from the original..
Hypatia Pickens: which is under glass
Hypatia Pickens: and touchable by no one.
Hot Cocoa Latte whispers: Hmm, hot cocoa..
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: lol Kali! CRAP will take on a new level of analysis
Hypatia Pickens: But it would put what is now only on CD-ROM into a 3D space
Hypatia Pickens: It might also mean being able to walk THROUGH a page and see the scribe at work.
Kathryn Pleides: Yes. Even the facsimile editions are thousands of dollars
hobbs Constantine: what about what we are experiencing right now...questioning clarity, definitions, connotations?
Hypatia Pickens: that's the kind of thing I'm interested in.
Kathryn Pleides: But online - free or almost!
Olivia Hotshot: oooh love that idea Hypatia
Hypatia Pickens: A visual interpretation of a lettered text.
Hypatia Pickens: The work behind a lettered text.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Hypatia, great idea....I'm imagining a giant illuminated MS to explore
Olivia Hotshot: Do you think that the new multi-media on a prim will help with this sort of literacy?
Hypatia Pickens: I'm trying to build a visual representation of the Pardoner's Tale... and there are a host of philosophical issues in that ...
Kali Pizzaro: mmm possibly
Hypatia Pickens: Yes i do Olivia...
Hypatia Pickens: but only available to the 2.0 crowd.
Olivia Hotshot: for now...
Kali Pizzaro: i certinly learn better when i a=can visulise a concept
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: pedagogically, yes...I could make a virtual iPad my students could take on tours with advice/examples pre-loaded
Hypatia Pickens: Nice idea Iggy
Kali Pizzaro: the heart anatomy
Teri Boxen: yes
Grinn Pidgeon: making the abstract visible and physical interests me
Margaret Michalski: I agree with Kali, seeing things makes you thing. I put more thought nto it and remember better
Hypatia Pickens: Grins and Grinn
Olivia Hotshot: so walking through a visual representation of a story, watching movie type images and hearing the audio - a better way to gain knowledge than reading? OR just another way?
Hypatia Pickens: making the abstract visible indeed!
Hypatia Pickens: Yes Olivia
Hypatia Pickens: Exactly what I'm trying to do...
Hypatia Pickens: but not retelling the story
Jerod Bagley: Good question Olivia. Multimedia on a prim is nothing more than the 2D we have had for years on the Web and inserting it in SL. So is that really an advance? I don't know.
Kali Pizzaro: another way a different learning style
Birdie Newcomb: Depends on what you want to get out of it
Olivia Hotshot: So the objective matters.
hobbs Constantine: It's not all about the visual
Kali Pizzaro: however i dont have one
Hypatia Pickens: No.... exactly right hobbs
CindyBolerosAlt Sorbet: Roleplay has always been a good immersion. Virtual worlds enhances that
Olivia Hotshot: the visual is a means to gaining knowledge
Hypatia Pickens: it's also about hearing people read things
Birdie Newcomb: One school of thought says that language is required in order to think
Kali Pizzaro: yes clinical simulation is better in sl for me so far
Kali Pizzaro: online that is
Olivia Hotshot: So, from what i am reading, virtual worlds do offer the opportunities--How can immersive education help students develop and improve observational skills?
Kathryn Pleides: Anyone viewing a pet trying to figure something out knows that language isn't needed for thinking. It does influence the shape of thinking though
Kathryn Pleides: and allow much deeper/more complex thought
Soleil Lemondrop: so do we need different *literacies* to learn in an in-world simulation?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Olivia...students in my experience only spot surfaces, read for plot
Hypatia Pickens: Well, we aren't animals. We use language ... have for hundreds of thousands of years
Ruby Lysette: Perhaps not everything lends itself to immersion. We need to be selective.
Olivia Hotshot: @soleil, interesting idea.
Hypatia Pickens: @Iggy.... yes .... they will watch a movie and it slips right past them... can't remember what they've seen.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: the Ansel Adams assignment asked them to look at least twice, with reflection between. And the first part of analysis is a taking apart, like a dissection, before seeing relationships
Hypatia Pickens: Only the general plot.
Kathryn Pleides: Language allows time-binding, as in being communicated with by dead authors.
Margaret Michalski: @ Olivia, yes, because you need to look and watch what you are doing.
Birdie Newcomb: So, do we learn from experiences, or just remember them?
Grinn Pidgeon: Extending oneself into a virtual world puts you also in a position to observe yourself and how you have represented yourself
Olivia Hotshot agrees with @Margaret
Hypatia Pickens: Remembering is key to learning
Kathryn Pleides: What kind of time-binding are we leaving for the future, in the ephemeral products of the web?
Hypatia Pickens: So make something memorable.
Kali Pizzaro: although we have all this multimedia we still quite have text next to it
Kali Pizzaro: often
Olivia Hotshot: 29 people on the sim for the transcript
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: learn, Birdie....having just escaped a RL black widow's bite...I'll be more careful lifting old lumber!
Kali Pizzaro: sorry
Hypatia Pickens: that's part of the multimedia isn't it?
Kali Pizzaro: so learning by doing
Birdie Newcomb: ouch
Hypatia Pickens: Or at least have the doing and the reading related.
Profdan Netizen: Well, how do we learn traditional literacy?
Birdie Newcomb: Now SL is good at that -- I learn by doing, building, transforming
Hypatia Pickens: We used to make pictures in our heads.... I did when i read.
Kathryn Pleides: The learning isn't the literacy - the literacy enables the learning
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Profdan--"current traditional" pedagogy of the writing classroom was the old way
Kali Pizzaro: yep
Kali Pizzaro: at Hypia
Hypatia Pickens: I agree with Kath
Profdan Netizen: Yeah, Iggy, but it's not been considered the most effective way for some time.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Read Orwell's "Shooting an Elephant" and then write like Orwell...LOL
Kali Pizzaro: it is complex
Olivia Hotshot: very
Profdan Netizen: The point is we learn by reading, writing, reflective, lots of practice, working with others, talking...
Hypatia Pickens: Draw a picture of the elephant falling to its death.
Kathryn Pleides: viewing, listening, doing....
Jerod Bagley: Good point Kathryn
Birdie Newcomb: or have learned that way
Hypatia Pickens: Examine why the rifle is hollow.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Dan, that's not the point...the legacy crops up when faculty step outside their areas of expertise. I find they fall back on it. And we're all at our limits in virtual worlds.
Profdan Netizen: Exactly, Kathryn.
Soleil Lemondrop: @Kath- multimedia literacy opens our possibilities for learning...
Birdie Newcomb: Reading and writing are very specialized activities, requiring us to shut out all other visual stimuli
Kathryn Pleides: @Sol - expands, yes
Olivia Hotshot: Does anyone here do any observational methods instruction here in SL?
Hypatia Pickens: @Iggy.... I have so much to learn this summer... the research is staggering to do this.
Birdie Newcomb: When we bring those stimuli b ack in, what happens?
Profdan Netizen: It is the point, Iggy--how we learn multiple literacies has its analogue in how we really learn to read and write.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Hypatia, in SL your avatar could climb into a giant rife, examine the rifling in the barrel, become a bullet and be shot into the elephant
Katya Anatine: What do you mean by "observational methods?"
Hypatia Pickens: Okay.... but how would that make me understand Orwell's point?
Kali Pizzaro: how lovely Iggy
Hypatia Pickens: About the hollowness of the British empire?
Trudy Takacs: @Profdan yes
Soleil Lemondrop: @ Birdie we can learn and understand more-- aesthetics, metaphoric, conceptual ides
Kathryn Pleides: Hy - yes
Margaret Michalski: @ Olivia, I have a faculty member that might use SL for observational qualitative research
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Kali---thinking like the RL hillbilly I am about "shootin' stuff" :)
Hypatia Pickens: @Iggy... not a good use of the essay
Olivia Hotshot: Earlier people mentioned that often students only see the glaring big pictures. i was wondering if anyone teaching observation skills to studemts
Katya Anatine: I have students doing ethnographies in SL too ...
Hypatia Pickens: I'm trying to do that on my sim....
Kali Pizzaro: well we try in nursing
Kali Pizzaro: ;-)
Hypatia Pickens: with things they fall into by surprise.....
Birdie Newcomb: Earlier books had woodcuts and illustrations -- but they proved to be a distraction and have almost entirely disappeared.
Birdie Newcomb: Visual literacy is a different animal.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Dan, I'll concede the point, but in SL, too often I've heard faculty, even on of our presenters from last week say "I send my students out to just explore"
Kathryn Pleides: argh
Hypatia Pickens: haha
Kathryn Pleides: explore what? where?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: without guidelines and goals, they fall into a version of the CT pedagogy of the old-style writing class
Kathryn Pleides: to learn what?
Margaret Michalski: @ Iggy, didn't you have a class that took snapshots and analyzed tem
Olivia Hotshot: and how do they decide what to focus on, what is important, what isn't?
Profdan Netizen: Agreed, Iggy, not too helpful.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I give my classes guidelines about how to decipher images, still or moving, about the cultural composition of the world they visit.
Margaret Michalski: sorry spelling problems : )
Olivia Hotshot: So having guidelines and goals could possibly help students cultivate more sophisticated observational skills?
Hypatia Pickens: I sometimes wonder if paper and colored pencils might not work as well in the class room as sitting there and taking notes from the teacher.
Katya Anatine: Mine learn how to take qualitative field notes, and then can come to SL to practice specific observation techniques.
Hypatia Pickens: Make them draw the metaphors.
Profdan Netizen: Question, though: how is having students explore something in SL different from having students observe in RL?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: My colleague Beeble Baxter (SL) is really good about visual analysis involving RL observation. He has several nature-based assignments to teach ways of seeing.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: *seeing
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Profdan, IRL you don't have that SL camera ability, for one
Hypatia Pickens: The drawing may give us ideas about how to build a simulation that helps us understand the nature of metaphor.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: it's the best tool of visual work in SL...learning the camera
Hypatia Pickens: Yes!
Profdan Netizen: Good point.
Kathryn Pleides: @Hy - for some students, it might work better!
Olivia Hotshot: also in SL you have no danger factor about getting close or falling etc. to go investigate
Hypatia Pickens: thanks Kath
Olivia Hotshot: Could we get some examples? What sites in SL are good exemplars of graphical design, 3D
rendering, and media use?
Hypatia Pickens: Bryn Oh's sim....
Arika Baroque: the IRL sites are great
Olivia Hotshot: Immersiva
Soleil Lemondrop: @Profdan, interesting question, much to consider about the choices that have been made to design and express visually...we don't choose buildings, nature etc in RL but in world they may say something about the intentions etc
Hypatia Pickens: obviously....
Hypatia Pickens: yes.. Bryn Oh's Immersiva.....
Kathryn Pleides: Elf Clan's Unicorn Island
Hypatia Pickens: But also some great built art-scenes by Scottius Polke...
Hypatia Pickens: Lunamaruna....
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: ah, Bryn Oh! What genius...new form of art, IMO
Olivia Hotshot: Yes, he is a dear friend.. has sat on his socks.
Hypatia Pickens: Incredible
Katya Anatine nods - SL is more than the art/renderings, though.
Ilene Pratt: Architecture in RL is about choice, isn't it? Someone did the choosing, huh?
Hypatia Pickens: hahahahah Olivia!
Hypatia Pickens: But if the art renderings make a point...... Katya
Olivia Hotshot: Have you seen his socks Hypatia?
Hypatia Pickens: Art is a great educator.
Hypatia Pickens: I have Olivia!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I was hoping we'd put some SLURLs and examples into the chat today for our classes
Katya Anatine: Sure - but it's not the only.
Hypatia Pickens: Why isn't art a form of expression?
Soleil Lemondrop: @Ilene, yes, but I didnt choose the architecture of my office etc
Olivia Hotshot: Do art galleries count?
Kathryn Pleides: Iggy - good idea
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Oivia--you bet
Kathryn Pleides: Olivia - why not?
Hypatia Pickens: You are speaking as though Art is supplemental to communication and not a communication.
Soleil Lemondrop: @Profdan rl vs sl observation: in rl I can't see your "profile"!
Birdie Newcomb: It's a subtle one
Hypatia Pickens: Why is the design of your office relevant?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: here's a cute spot: Art Box..you can be in a painting for photograph
Ilene Pratt: But you could observe the architecture around you and what it might mean to you. What's the Palace at Versailles mean?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Klaw/6/21/47
Profdan Netizen: Good point, Soleil.
Kathryn Pleides: heh, why are we sitting in chairs at a table 'looking' at each other instead of just typing on IRC?
Olivia Hotshot: Kathryn, just asking
Hypatia Pickens: Ha Kathryn!
Soleil Lemondrop: @Hypatia the architecture in SL, the space and how I look is an expression and choice-- may change with mood
Kali Pizzaro: http://iml.usc.edu/
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Kathryn...the very typing gesture gives us some RL cues to helpus manage a big group
Hypatia Pickens: agreed Soleil
Hypatia Pickens: sorry
Hypatia Pickens: thought you were asking a rhetorical question
Kathryn Pleides: of course, some turn off the typing gesture
Olivia Hotshot: Folks if you have a slurl to post please do.
Hypatia Pickens: We have faces in here.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: anyone have the SLURL for the Bogon Flux?
Olivia Hotshot: oh i do iggy one sec
Hypatia Pickens: Do we just drag a lm into the chat box?
Soleil Lemondrop: it is fun, there is that. its fun to see y'all ;-)
Hypatia Pickens: (sorry for ignorance)
Kali Pizzaro: http://www.academy.gcal.ac.uk/llida/
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: it's a life-changer--a city that builds itself, then self destructs
Kali Pizzaro: this is an interesting project some might like to look at
Hypatia Pickens: Oooh... would love to see that.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: you climb into it
Profdan Netizen: I do think that part of the literacy of SL is realizing it as a place, even though virtual, hence Boellstorff's ability to study its culture.
Kali Pizzaro: link above
Kathryn Pleides: @Iggy - yes, but --- some folks turn it off as being a distraction from immersion
Olivia Hotshot: http://slurl.com/secondlife/The%20Wastelands/135/151/66
Hypatia Pickens: wow Prof.... agreed!
Kathryn Pleides: (typing gesture)
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: from Bettina Tizzy's NPIRL blog: http://npirl.blogspot.com/2008/11/this-just-in-awesome-vid-of-bogon-flux.html
Olivia Hotshot: there ya go iggy
Iggy's note: Here's a YouTube video documenting this amazing build:
Katya Anatine: I think that if we aren't considering the human interaction with the renderings, not just one person's interaction, but the whole social aspect of how the designer intends/how avatars actually use the graphics, we're missing a lot. Communication is bigger ...
Hypatia Pickens: If Only I could get my fellow colleagues to understand that Profdan
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: thanks Olivia--we're a good tag-team today
Olivia Hotshot: hehe
Zotarah Shepherd: Literature Alive! is good too.
Hypatia Pickens: We're taking pictures, here. :)
Hypatia Pickens: that says something....
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: one thing that we've not discussed so far, unless I missed it, is the multimedia construction of the avatar itself.
Profdan Netizen: The interaction with others is what makes SL as present as it is.
Zotarah Shepherd: Might want to silent your camera
Hypatia Pickens: can't do that in a chat room.
Hypatia Pickens: MM construction of avatar..... such as?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Vie and deWinter last week noted they have their students do that as an early project
Olivia Hotshot: Bogon Image: http://www.flickr.com/photos/oliviahotshot/2957879148/
Hypatia Pickens: sound?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: why an avie is non-human, over-sexualized, dressed a certain way, etc.
Kathryn Pleides: @Iggy - and how our avatar is chosen to present us?
Hypatia Pickens: whooshing noises as we teleport?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: right, Kathryn
Bungy Bingyi: thanks all - gtg
Hypatia Pickens: Oh.
Hypatia Pickens: Multimedia in that sense?
Kali Pizzaro: 21 for the transcript
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: in part...and it's a great place to get students to start
Birdie Newcomb: aren't we all oversexed in SL?
Hypatia Pickens: hahahah Birdie.....
Hypatia Pickens: How about in RL?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Avatars combine color, textures, affect
Hypatia Pickens thinks of Victoria's Secret
Zotarah Shepherd: I tend to be modest in both worlds.
Birdie Newcomb: So does clothing
Hypatia Pickens: I tend to be artistic in both worlds....
Kathryn Pleides: LL has some odd ideas about human proportions, to be sure
Ruby Lysette: We all look fab. It's the great equalizer.
Olivia Hotshot chuckles at Ruby
Olivia Hotshot: Good point.
Hypatia Pickens: I don't follow LL.... I make my own shape and face....... I hate the oversexualization actually....
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Hypatia--but SL distances us enough from the subject so writers get what some scholars of writing call "the craftsman's distance" from the work.
Kathryn Pleides wonders how our meetings might go differently if we all came as furries, or Tinies, or dragons
Hypatia Pickens: agreed Iggy....
Olivia Hotshot: Any more sims to be added?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: might be too personal at first to send kids to the mall for a visual analysis
Hypatia Pickens: what is "the craftsman's distance" though/
Hypatia Pickens: In terms of the self?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Hypatia...if you create work, you often need to step back to distance yourself to see flaws or good bits
Profdan Netizen: Though might be an interesting second round, to have them take the same observational activities they do in SL into RL, to look with fresh eyes.
Birdie Newcomb: a kind of subjective objectivity
Hypatia Pickens: Yes. Kill your darlings.
Hypatia Pickens: Like the Gracie kendall project
Hypatia Pickens: She is writing a MA about how she is learning to become more like her avatar.
Olivia Hotshot: @Profdan- what if one did a parallel project - the reading literacy end in the rl and then to do the immersive like Hypatia was suggesting - with a text?
Hypatia Pickens: Olivia that was a question raised by my audience...
Profdan Netizen: sounds intriguing.
Hypatia Pickens: to whom was I pitching my sim?
Hypatia Pickens: For those who had read Chaucer first?
Olivia Hotshot: oh? tell me more Hypatia.
Hypatia Pickens: Or to those who were potential readers?
Soleil Lemondrop: I've been thinking about these issues in a research context- for interviews in world, how do observations impact what we "hear" from an interviewee? AND how much of the avatar's presentation/profile/chosen setting is "fair game" or should it be described in the informed consent? is it
Hypatia Pickens: I gave a talk to my colleagues in prep for a talk I have to give at the Medieval Congress..
Hypatia Pickens: and the persistent question was:
Hypatia Pickens: who was my audience in SL?
Hypatia Pickens: And what did I expect them to know before they walked through my sim?
Hypatia Pickens: And also, why do a visual representation when you can just read the text?
Hypatia Pickens: The other most persistent question.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: these are great Qs for anyone planning to build in a VW
CindyBolerosAlt Sorbet: reading text is not as fun as virtual world.
Profdan Netizen: What can you learn about the story from the sim, that you wouldn't get from just the text?
Hypatia Pickens: I responded that it wasn't supposed to BE the text.
Hypatia Pickens: that it approached reading the text from another angle and art form.
Hypatia Pickens: But they were skeptical and bewildered.
Arika Baroque: it depends what type of learner you are whether you get more from the text or not
Soleil Lemondrop: @ Cindy..."fun" again, it counts for something in terms of motivation to learn and understand i think
Profdan Netizen: A similar question can be raised between a text and the movie version?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: found my reference..Donald Murray's article "Teaching the Other Self: The Writer's First Reader" about getting distance to analyze one's own work
Hypatia Pickens: Yes... Profdan...
Olivia Hotshot: Good point @profdan
Hypatia Pickens: but both tell a story in chronological order.
Hypatia Pickens: I have to cross that DIVIDE....
Olivia Hotshot: --How are your curricula preparing students to understand new media literacy?
Margaret Michalski: @ Arika, I agree wit you. I am more of a visual learner.
Hypatia Pickens: from chronology into achronology
Hypatia Pickens: @me Olivia?
Hypatia Pickens: We are just now delving into Digital Media and Digital Humanities.
Olivia Hotshot: has anyone redesigned their curriculum recently to reflect this "new" sort of literacy?
Hypatia Pickens: Well behind, say, Duke.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: hey, in SL you can change the story! Margaret was Madeline Usher two weeks ago. Our "Usher" never ends like Poe's did.
Hypatia Pickens: Yes.
Olivia Hotshot: That was for anyone Hypatia
Hypatia Pickens: Ooooh!
Kali Pizzaro: well we have tried to use a combination of media in nursing for a wile
Hypatia Pickens: Okay.... sorry! :)
Kali Pizzaro: as some of the concepts are difficult to grasp initially
Kathryn Pleides: Did any of the students want to do a machinima with the Poe set?
Kali Pizzaro: but it was more video, pics
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: It's hard for them, Kathryn. The semester is short. But they take pics, yest.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: *yes
Hypatia Pickens: and machinima is hard to master.......
Arika Baroque: in Idea generation classes we use You Tube and sometimes use Twitter feeds so the students can submit their opinions for all to see
Hypatia Pickens: I'm trying....
Kali Pizzaro: interesting @ Arika
CindyBolerosAlt Sorbet: Machinima is only as good as the hardware you have avalable
Hypatia Pickens sighs.... true
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I'll be bold...all humanities will be digital eventually. Or they won't survive.
Profdan Netizen: I'm happy if I can get students to use voice and read their drafts to each other!
Birdie Newcomb: or the operator
Ilene Pratt: So.... when you have students take photos and do YouTube, etc. do they get a new language to critique and analyze that kind of multimedia? Different from just the stuff they use to analyze text?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Not all media will be digital, however.
Olivia Hotshot: Digital religion, Iggy?
Hypatia Pickens: that's what a number of scholars are saying, Iggy... agreed!!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Olivia--neo-pagan groups meets in SL b/c they are geographically isolated IRL
Arika Baroque: sometimes students respond by bringing in other media that they find on the web during our discussions
Kathryn Pleides: "gimme that online religion"
Profdan Netizen: There will always be a place for analogue, Iggy! Vinyl rules!
Ruby Lysette: As a librarian I'm amazed at how often students prefer print to digital/audio/video. Very odd.
Olivia Hotshot: other religious groups do too, Iggy. I was thinking more of the content than the meeting aspect
Arika Baroque: we have Internet in the classroom which is a blessing and a curse
Hypatia Pickens: New literacy........... I'm so tired of correcting the standard received grammar on papers.
Hypatia Pickens: But that's what students expect.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Profdan--that's b/c Led Zep sounds better on vinyl
Ilene Pratt: Ruby, I notice the same thing - Sometimes they say "just vie me a book!"
Kathryn Pleides: y4 u say th@, Hy?
Ilene Pratt: oops I mean "give me a book" ;)
Kathryn Pleides ducks
Profdan Netizen: LOL, Iggy, definitely.
Hypatia Pickens: LOL @ Kath....
Hypatia Pickens: Say what Kath? I'm already talking too much.
Hypatia Pickens ducks
Hypatia Pickens feels very excited... hard to contain it.......
Kathryn Pleides: quack
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Olivia, good point. But the Chebi Mosque (now gone) in SL was a meeting place for Muslims who went there b/c it recaptured the sense of Al Andalus, that ended in 1492
Zotarah Shepherd: Some students resist immersion in a subject and media can be more immersive.
Kathryn Pleides suddenly feels very silly, like she should be wearing a Tiny avatar
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: They could got to mosque IRL but the Chebi build offered something more
Hypatia Pickens: I think some students are as reluctant as some teachers to embrace the new media.
Profdan Netizen: Until you can lend ebooks, I'd rather have print.
Kathryn Pleides: @Iggy - that's cool
Ruby Lysette: But they're so into gaming
Ignatius Onomatopoeia is silly w/o his tiny avatar, Kathryn :)
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Ruby, I missed that--who's into gaming? Not UR students
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: they want to socialize IRL and move up the career ladder...games take too much time away
Profdan Netizen: @Kathryn, sometimes the same is so for students with learning community--they don't want to work with others, just want to get their work done, and move on.
Olivia Hotshot: Well folks, our time is almost out, but before we leave i want to let you know that next week's conversation is about Copyright and Intellectual Property - will be in voice.
Ruby Lysette: Yes, students, but I think they really want to keep leisure and learning separate.
Chimera Cosmos: Who is coming O?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: great topic, Olivia!
Margaret Michalski: Important topic
Olivia Hotshot: Stephen Wu (SL: Legal Writer) Head of the SL Bar association and incoming chair of the ABA
Hypatia Pickens: cool Olivia... would be interested in hearing about copybots and the controversy....
Olivia Hotshot: I am sure he will have a lot to say.
Chimera Cosmos: kewl
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: btw, plug for the Heritage Key transcripts--check them out and go visit HK...great visual learning there! http://vwer.org --> transcripts link
Margaret Michalski: Thanks Olivia!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: thanks Olivia!
Soleil Lemondrop: thanks!
Hypatia Pickens: thanks Olivia again for a great session.
Kathryn Pleides: @Prof - true. I so often run into the other ones - those who spend so much time on the look/decoration of their project that they have no time/interest for the substance of it
Hypatia Pickens: Hour flew by!
Olivia Hotshot: and speaking of such, i have a nice email from the lindens saying something i bought on XStreet was removed from my inventory as it breached Intellectual property. this will be a great topic
Olivia Hotshot: Thank you all for coming today.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: LOL watch out Dan. Our Led Zep shirts are next
Kali Pizzaro: great crowd what a complex subject literacy is never mind multimedia literacy haha
Profdan Netizen: Interesting.
Hypatia Pickens: HA Olivia!
Lolly Dovgal: Thanks, Olivia.
Kathryn Pleides tried to convince some kids today that it really really helps to know _what_ you're going to say before you start your project
Zotarah Shepherd: Thank you Olivia
Kathryn Pleides: Kali - yes
Profdan Netizen: We should all have a Led Zeppelin shirt, Iggy!
Chimera Cosmos: Wow, what was it Olivia?
Chimera Cosmos: the removed item?
Hypatia Pickens: good point Kathryn
Samakah Sautereau: thanks all
Katya Anatine: Thanks all
Margaret Michalski: See ya all next week
Ignatius Onomatopoeia will make us some!
Kathryn Pleides: Great talk!
Olivia Hotshot: Chim, it was a dance set
Profdan Netizen accepted your inventory offer.
Lolly Dovgal: I took some pics and will upload them to Flickr
Lolly Dovgal: Bye all
Olivia Hotshot: i needed some cheap ones for an event
Hypatia Pickens: Bye friends!
Olivia Hotshot: Bye Everyone.
Profdan Netizen: Thanks, iggy!
Hypatia Pickens: yes thanks Iggy!
Kali Pizzaro: me too pics need to find my password lol
Margaret Michalski: Thanks again olivia! Good job
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: see you all soon
Kali Pizzaro: great job all
Olivia Hotshot: Appreciate it Margaret
Hypatia Pickens: Hey Lo!
Chimera Cosmos: huh - so were they dances copied by the seller from another SL creator?
Olivia Hotshot: i guess so, but they posted them as if they were theirs.
Chimera Cosmos: yeah
Hypatia Pickens: So... they came in and took them out of your closet.
Chimera Cosmos: that's the sort of thing creators keep asking Linden to do, but I didn't realize they actively did it
Chimera Cosmos: very often
Arika Baroque: thanks Olivia
Chimera Cosmos: interesting
Olivia Hotshot: yes, woke up to the email
Olivia Hotshot: Welcome Arika
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: as I just said to Olivia in IM "it's not the same SL any more"
Profdan Netizen: Has this happened before, Olivia?
Chimera Cosmos: must have been an egregious amount of selling of the copied ones that got their attention
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Rosedale was right...the Burning Man Era is over, period.
Perplexity Peccable sighs
Hypatia Pickens: there was an interesting Designing Worlds conference an hour ago about the Client Detection System.
Hypatia Pickens: Maybe we could talk about that next Tuesday.
Callista Silvansky: Olivia: did you get reimbursed, or is it just an unfortunate loss on your end?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: CDS has raised a lot of hackles
Olivia Hotshot: OK< i need to scoot. Have a great day everyone.
Chimera Cosmos: I'm sure there are still pockets of people burning men around SL here and there heheh
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: me too...see y'all soon
Hypatia Pickens: Yes... Just learning about it.
Kali Pizzaro: hey night night guys and gals